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The Principal called me today...

post #1 of 32
Thread Starter 
and I am glad that he did take the initiative. So now, I need your help. Your guidance and your thoughts as parents... and as a third party ... This is going to be long - but PLEASE I really need you !!

Long Story Not so Short:
Ryan used to attend daycare in another town with a "troubled" child. The child was violent, used bad words, was 4 years old and not even close to potty trained - not that I am judging but just a level set. He terrorized all of the kids. He never showed remorse. When Ryan was with this child, Ryans personality would change. He would act up more at home. To prove I am not overreacting - this child was actually kicked out of daycare at 4 years old. He then was sent to a new daycare, and kicked out for his beahvior and hitting a teacher over the head with a bay!! He was then forced into the towns pre-school program mid year.

He lives in our town and now attends kindergarten at Ryans school. Last summer when we were finding out who was in what class, all Ryan wanted to know is if this kid was in his or Kylers class. He is NOT in either class, however they do have recess together.

Update:
The 1st week of school went great. Ryan was excited and loved it. Then he started coming home begging not to go back. Crying. Telling me he is teased. Telling me everyone stares at him. He told me abotu a girl who makes a weird face at him. He is sucking his thumb more.

--Just to check in, I wrote a note to his teacher to see if all was well and how he was adjusting (he is always shy but this was different). She responded that he is adjusting etc and doing well.

Yesterday- Ryan got off the bus and showed me his eye (scratches and alot of dirt gunked in. He said " I hate __ ___" so being the mom I said that isnt niceto say, I know he doesn't like him etc - he said it again and told me about how he got sand in his eye etc. The way the incident occured it was purposeful. Kyler was there and got the teacher, and Ryan actually had to go to the nurse to flush his eye out. Later that evening I also found out (from Shari and confirmed by Ryan) that this boy spit on him and another boy. Ryan has now confessed that Jacob has been doing alot of bad things to him - but he 'cant remember' ....

Last Night Out of nowhere - Ryan flipped out. I am not talking tantrum - I am talking uncontrollable - kicking, screaming, hitting, bad words, and biting - ME. I lterally could not control him. This went on for about 2 1/2 hours. He was acting just like this little boy. It was a nightmare. I was home alone with him and Aidan - and it was just the most radical behavior ever.

Ryan has had some behavior issues- but he really is a good kid -he sometimes has a hard time with listening but not to THIS extent.

This morning I wrote a note to his teacher. I explained the incidents with this boy, their history, and Ryans behavior last night (and again re-appeared this morning). Ryans teacher was NOT in school today- so the sub gave it to the principal who called me.

He told me the sand was not malicious - it was just what happens in the sandbox (I disgaree- he heard the story differently than both Ryan and Kyler told us) ... anyhow, all in all- he told me he would be adding 2 more resources to recess- and let me know they are aware of the troubled kids and are working on them...

He was nice and told me to call or email him with any concerns....
post #2 of 32
Thread Starter 
Continued:

When Ryan got off the bus today, he told me that he accidentally but his friend. I called his friends mom to tell her, and have him apologize. When she asked her son he said they were wrestling and Ryan bit him and he knew it was an accident. Ryan told me they were kicking and hitting each other.... Kyler told Shari Ryan bit his friend - but no one was wrestling or kicking anyone. I also advised Ryans friends mom about the issue at school, and I didnt know if Ryan was acting out because of it. She asked her son and they he told her about issues with this boy too.

Its like pulling teeth though to get them to tell us the details...

Now ...


Does it seem like Ryans attitude and new behavior (which includes him pointing and TEASING at home) is a reaction to him being "bullied" at school? ? With him acting like this last night and this morning with me ... and now finding out he bit someone on the bus - I am not sure if It is all related ...

I dont want to overlook something that is affecting him ... but I can not tell if this is what has been putting him into a shell these last few weeks - and his behavior slowly morphing into something I can not control..

I should also note ... usually if someone does something to Ryan he WILL retaliate ...however for this one boy - he will not. And he will not tattle.


HELP
post #3 of 32
that sounds horrible. i think i remember you talking about this boy and daycare a while back.

i hope that having some people aware of the problem and actually watching out for trouble helps
post #4 of 32
I'll have to find those resources I found a while ago on bullying. My dd can get violent too, so know that you are not alone.
post #5 of 32
This article from NPR seems to have a lot of resources with it. I try to talk to my dd when she becomes violent. Not that I am sure it helps. I ask her "Is kate angry?" Why is Kate angry? What made Kate angry? Can we just say we are angry? Etc. So far it doesn't seem to be helping much. I just hope it's beginning to make her think about things more.
post #6 of 32
Here's another really good resource on bullying - http://kidshealth.org/parent/emotion...r/bullies.html
post #7 of 32
wow... it sounds like it's coming from the bullying... i hope that now that the principal and teachers are aware that things will get better!!
post #8 of 32
Well hopefully they can keep a closer eye on recess time and Ryan can feel safe again and then things for him can calm down
post #9 of 32
oh wow hon. I think that if the principal is not going to take alll this seriously....is there a school counsellor or someone else you can talk to? Talk to his teacher and let him/her know about it all
post #10 of 32
You know that I feel the same way as you... and I'm not sure what the best course of action is either.

How did tonight go?
post #11 of 32
If it was me, and I am paranoid so.. this is probably not a good idea for you lol, I would make sure the teacher, or whomever, kept the two separated. Even during recess. None of this wait and see stuff.
post #12 of 32
Yeah I agree with Shona and I would ask that this child is kept away from Ryan. I have no advice for you, but is sure sounds like that kid needs serious help. Is the other mom going to call the principal as well? I think he needs to know that it is not just a "ryan and this kid" issue, that it is this "kid and others" problem. Poor Ryan to have to go through this so young.

What are the other kids teasing him about?
post #13 of 32
Thread Starter 
Thanks Lenora for that website and for everyones words.

I am not sure what other kids are teasing him about - or if there are other kids actually teasing him... he did tell me that 1 girl doesnt want to play with him because she says she doesnt play with boys (which I explained to him is normal - but he always played with girls before so he isnt used to it) and another girl he says stares at him with her mouth open ... so I dont know of there is more too it - maybe something is wrong with that girl?? I dont know ...

Its really hard to say, is he just the shy kid and he FEELS like he is being teased? He did recently start doing the pointing 'Ha ha ' type of thing, so he is SEEING teasing. Is it to him by other kids -

The only one I DO know of ... is this one kid... the thing is- I know I am the MOM - but Ryan doesnt fit in my 'idea' of the typical kid to get bullied ... thats bad of me to stereotype ...

He had a great night last night and a great morning so far. Hopefully today will be the same.
post #14 of 32
That's so sad that he is already being bullied at such a young age! I'm so sensitive to those things that I would probably look into changing his school, but I know not everyone will agree with that. I put Haley in about five different places until she was happy and there was definitely a mood change that went along with each school. It's crazy how others have that effect on them, but they do.
post #15 of 32
Because my parents forced a lot of milk on me as a kid, I had chronic respiratory problems and stood around a lot with my mouth open. I don't know if this girl has the same problem, but perhaps she can't really breathe that well and it's not personal.
post #16 of 32
Thread Starter 
well... I found out that little girl who holds her mouth open ... I guess she only STARTED doing it - when Ryan was in the library and he was reading a book with her. I guess he skipped a page - and it all started there. She said he was dumb etc - and makes that look with her mouth open "duh" and now she does it all the time!! Nothing I can do about that, and I want to tell Ryan to ugnore it, but he doesn't like it and it hurts his feelings...

on a side note ... at soccer this weekend we saw the real 'bully' - in their group photo he sat next to Ryan and you could just see the look on Ryans face like - PLEASE dont let him sit next to me ... this kid was TRYING to play with Ryan - and they got in 1 altercation - but ... Shari did hear him yell Bye to Ryan ... and Ryan basically ignored him (because he doesnt want to be friends with a kid thats mean to him) ... ad then Shari heard this boy tell his father Ryan is his friend ,, so this bully obviously has alot of issues... if he thinks they are friends - then he needs to learn how to be a friend better
post #17 of 32
Can you contact his former teacher and ask her to call the principal and fill him in on the all the background? He may be more willing to listen when it's coming from a "fellow educator" = KWIM?
post #18 of 32
Here's what I think you should do:
Schedule a conference with the teacher AND the principal AND request that a guidance counselor be present. Do NOT let them blow you off.
From my experience as a teacher, parents were taken A LOT more seriously when they took the time to schedule a conference and to come in and voice their concerns and ask for action to be taken.
I would not call the former teacher. I would just go in, explain your concerns from this year, and go frm there. I would explain to them the change in Ryan's behavior. I would also tell them what you told us--he won't tattle on this kid, and I would emphasize to them how much this troubles you and the fact that while he is there at THAT SCHOOL you count on the TEACHERS and the ADMINISTRATORS to protect him from this. I would also let them know that if the "sand issue" is "just something that happens with the sandbox," then they need to GET RID OF THE SANDBOX because eye issues are something that happens when kids get sand in their eyes and it sure would be terrible if that happened again and this time Ryan's (or another child's) eyes were damaged and the school was held liable. I am sorry, but there is no excuse for a flippant answer like that to a legitimate safety issue. Kids Emily's age might not know better than to throw sand (though SHE knows better), but kids the age of Ryan and this little terror know better and that principal d@mn well knows it, he just doesn't want to take responsibility. And in my opinion, that's just the beginning of the issues with this principal. So, please take my advice and go in there and meet with the three of them face to face. Let them know you are serious and don't let THEM BULLY YOU or minimize your concerns. You are his mom, and you know something is not right. This isn't just going to work itself out, and also, I agree with Shona, you should request that the teacher keep them separated. And you know, I know that's not easy when the teacher has other kids to keep up with, but any effort at all that can be put toward keeping this kid away from Ryan is a help and it's less opportunity for this kid to bully/terrorize/aggravate/hurt, etc Ryan.
Also, I think this Jacob kid has some social issues. He may not THINK he is bullying Ryan. My nephew had these issues when he was their age. He didn't know how to go up to a kid and say, "Do you want to play?" So, he would go up and push the kid down, or take the kid's toy, and then he would laugh like it was a joke. So, you can guess, he was not popular with most kids or paretns, but he honestly thought that was the way friends acted. I know! And my nephew is gifted. He's just socially a mess. He's improving, but still not great with the social stuff. So, that may be the case with this kid. Which means he needs help, and hopefully his parents will recognize that. I am rambling, and I know your real concern is Ryan.
I hope you don't think I am too pushy. It's just that I have seen this type of thing over and over when I taught, and you have to be an advocate for your kid. Sometimes you have good teachers who will stand up for them, which is truly what I would do, but you can't count on that.
post #19 of 32
By the way, let me clarify. Calling the former teacher is pointless. I am not sure if she can, by law, discuss this child or his history with the principal--I don't know what kind of rules/laws apply to day care teachers. But I KNOW that by law, Ryan's principal CANNOT discuss this child with the former teacher. So, not a lot could be accomplished by having her call, and there's no guarantee he would take her call or take her seriously since she isn't one of his teachers.
post #20 of 32
Tammy, why can't the P discuss? I'm curious....OK, I admit it, I'm just flat out nosy !
post #21 of 32
It's against the law. It's a privacy issue. Educators cannot discuss anything about other students with anyone besides that student's parents or other school employees (like psychologists/social workers/cousnelors or with the Dept. of Family and Children's Services. If that makes sense. In other words, I could not discuss Student A in any form with Student B's parents. I could get sued or lose my job. It's against the educator's code of ethics and against the law. It's just like a doctor, your doctor can't discuss your medical history or anything about you with another person, unless you give written consent.
post #22 of 32
Not to change the subject - but I need to look into this more.

When I went to daycare 1 - they would NOT tell you who "hurt" your child. Said it was against the rules. But then daycare #2 WOULD tell you. So would the Nursery School.

So... I did a little bit of looking around into this (due to opening my own daycare) and wanting to find out exactly what the "law" was... and I can't find it anywhere. I talked to the State Licensing department and they said that you "could" tell a parent. That it just sometimes stirred the pot a little bit.
I'll have to look deeper to make sure it's not a law and I can't get sued over something like that. Or if it falls more into the ethical "what's right and what's wrong" category.
post #23 of 32
As I said, I can only speak for public school educators and administrators since I was a teacher. I don't know how the rules or laws apply to day care centers. I know at Emily's school last year there was a child who was diagnosed with hand, foot, and mouth disease and her teachers could not tell me who it was, only whether the child was in her class, and Emily was in a private Mom's Morning Out program. So, I don't know.
post #24 of 32
Hmmmm. Ok - interesting. Thanks for the heads up!
post #25 of 32
Shari, this is from the Georgia Professional Standards Commission, which is the state regulatory body in Georgia for public teachers.
(g) Standard 7: Confidential Information - An educator should comply with state and federal laws and local school board/governing board policies relating to the confidentiality of student and personnel records, standardized test material and other information covered by confidentiality agreements. Unethical conduct includes but is not limited to:
1. sharing of confidential information concerning student academic and disciplinary records, personal confidences, health and medical information, family status and/or income, and assessment/testing results. unless disclosure is required or permitted by law;
2. sharing of confidential information restricted by state or federal law;
3. violation of confidentiality agreements related to standardized testing including copying or teaching identified test items, publishing or distributing test items or answers, discussing test items, violating local school system or state directions for the use of tests or test items, etc.;
4. violation of other confidentiality agreements required by state or local policy.
By Georgia statute, the Professional Standards Commission has authority to take action against an educator's certificate, license or permit.
post #26 of 32
Ok. Thanks Tammy! I appreciate it!
post #27 of 32
On that side note...It's just bad form to discuss a child with ANYONE other than that chil'd's parents. I have parents ask ALL THE TIME about other kids. I can not, will not and have not discussed anything with parents other than their own child.

As for daycare....its just not a good idea IMO. Zach's school does not tell and I think it's a good idea. Out of curiosity I've wanted to know who bit Zach (for example) but NEVER asked the teacher. Thing is...people parent differently. Some parents teach the "hit back" philosophy. I run into it EVERY day. If my 2 year old did something inappropriate would I want a parent who tells their child to hit back to know what my kid did??? NO WAY. It is just a big can of worms.

As for Dee's problem....I can't beleive a teacher told you about the girl with the open mouth. I'd be beyond pissed if anything about my child was discussed with another parent in a public school. Beyond pissed. Pissed in a way that I'd be at the school meeting with the principal. And this is coming from a public school teacher. There is no excuse for discussing other children with parents.

I can never understand when parents even ask me about other kids. My response--"I can not discuss any children with you other than your own. I am sure understand this since you wouldn't want me discussing your child with other parents." This goes for past, present and future students.

Did that allmake sense? It's been a looooong day.
post #28 of 32
Exactly, Abby! It makes perfect sense.
post #29 of 32
I've actually had parents show up at my classroom door expecting to "speak with" another person's child. As if I'd allow that to happen!
post #30 of 32
It did make perfect sense!
Thanks!
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